S2EP83-Dr. Theresa Lyons-Dr. Lyons on Autism: Turning Science into Superpowers for Parents!

Herb: 00:00:19

I now have the pleasure of introducing Dr. Theresa Lyons. Dr. Lyons is an international autism educator, Ivy League scientist, and autism parent.

She's the founder and CEO of Navigating Autism, a groundbreaking platform that transforms the overwhelming complexity of autism science into clear, actionable steps for families.

With a PhD from Yale and a deeply personal mission, Dr. Lyons has worked with parents in over 21 countries, bringing evidence based strategies that change lives. Today, she'll share how her unique blend of rigorous science and real world experience is giving parents what they've never had before.

Clarity, confidence, and a roadmap for progress. Welcome, Teresa. It is a pleasure to have you here today. I wish we'd have been able to have this conversation about 34 years ago.

Dr. Theresa Lyons: 00:01:14

Well, thank you for having me. I'm. I'm happy to be here now, 34 years later.

Kristina: 00:01:20

Exactly.

Because even though, you know, we did our best as we were raising our son and we found out as much as we could, there's always new things that come up and new things that are learned. And the main focus of the show, of course, is helping other families navigate some of the stuff that maybe we didn't navigate so well as well.

So talk a little bit about the passion. You know, where, where does the autism focus in your platform? Where does that passion come from? And I think I kind of know, but tell us all about it.

Dr. Theresa Lyons: 00:01:49

So the passion definitely came from my daughter's diagnosis. I do have a PhD in computational chemistry from Yale.

I was working in the pharmaceutical industry, first as a researcher and then as a medical strategist. So that's more on the business side. So I have a pretty good understanding of healthcare, how it works, the flow of information.

And then when my daughter, there were certain milestones that weren't being hit and we had concerns, and so we started going through that entire process. And the passion really comes from, yes, my daughter being diagnosed. Right.

But it also comes from after that diagnosis, when I was expecting, as a medical strategist. Right. That I wanted the doctor, the specialist to give me my options. Right. So I wanted to know, okay, what is the gold standard?

What are the cutting edge. Tell me about the clinical trials. You know, what, what are we really looking here in chemistry?

And, you know, proteins, and I really wanted to get granular. That's. That's what I did for a living. And the reply was, all right, well, autism typically does not get better, it usually gets worse.

There's nothing you can really do health wise. There are some medications to give someone with autism, but that's really only done when they're very irritable. And there's behavioral.

But wait lists are long, and it doesn't really target a lot of the core issues. So that was my options. So that. Exactly.

Herb: 00:03:23

Better than what we got. Oh, but and coming from forward, it's like it is getting better because.

Because the parents had to do so much of the experimenting and the trying things because the doctors just kind of refused.

Kristina: 00:03:38

Yeah. And.

Dr. Theresa Lyons: 00:03:38

And so. So, right. This was 13 years ago. So my daughter was diagnosed 13 years ago. We were talking about you and your child. That was 34 years ago.

So it improved maybe a little bit. But there are parents that still get the same information that I got now. And, and that is just.

That's really where the passion comes from, because parents are operating with old information and they're not getting the full story as to what's possible for their child. And then they have a child who's not living up to their fullest potential. And most parents see it. They. They see it.

There are certain, like, good days that kids with autism have, and parents wonder, why can't they all be like that? Right.

Kristina: 00:04:20

And.

Dr. Theresa Lyons: 00:04:21

And they should be.

Kristina: 00:04:24

Yeah, it should. It should definitely be an easier road.

I mean, it's never going to be super easy, but if you can find those things that really make a difference and really tip the scale for you and your family and your child, that should be out there and should be available.

So that, again, part of the reason we have you on here today, to help us, you know, help parents really navigate some of this, maybe they haven't heard some of the information that you have. And so of the tips that. And techniques that you have that will really, really help. I know we've talked to many people that nutrition is a huge thing.

Right. They. They don't realize. Parents don't realize how if you don't give the child the right kind of nutrition, even if they're a picky eater.

Herb: 00:05:04

Right.

Kristina: 00:05:04

It can really escalate or scale things. So can you want to jump in there and tell us a little bit about that?

Dr. Theresa Lyons: 00:05:10

Well, definitely. I would start with the first bit of information that's really important for parents to know.

And this really, once I learned it and read it, I couldn't turn back in many ways.

Kristina: 00:05:22

Right.

Dr. Theresa Lyons: 00:05:22

Like, once you learn something, you're like, oh, okay.

So back when my daughter was diagnosed, the research showed that 10% of kids with autism lost their diagnosis, meaning they were not able to be diagnosed with autism after a few years. Now, autism, the diagnosis is made based on observation. Right.

And that is another source of frustration because it can look so different for so many people.

Kristina: 00:05:51

And.

Dr. Theresa Lyons: 00:05:54

So that means that this child didn't have any of those barriers in their health that would prevent them from, let's say, deficits in social communication. Right. In social interactions. That's one thing that a specialist would be looking for. That's a criteria for an autism diagnosis.

Another one is that restrictive repetitive behavior. And it you really wanted to. For it to qualify as a diagnosis, it means it really impacts their quality of life and their ability to live.

So this is not, you know, I tend to flip my hair, play with my hair a little bit, stuff like that. So that's repetitive, but it's really when it impedes someone's life.

And so when my daughter was diagnosed, it was 10% of kids with autism who were diagnosed lost their diagnosis because their parents were doing different things. Right? And I thought, okay, I need to talk to this researcher. What is this about? They called it an optimal outcome.

And parents were really focusing on health. So like you mentioned, diet is important. There's so many aspects to health that is important. And then fast forward to today, right?

So that was 13 years ago. What does the research say? So publications like this are done once a decade because it really takes time, right?

really does take time. So in: 2025

Herb: 00:07:36

Here's an interesting question, just, just on that alone, is, is there a difference in girls and boys? Is a greater percentage of that girls? Because autism is a lot harder to diagnose in girls. And.

And my sister was apparently autistic and didn't have a diagnosis until she was in her 30s. Another one of my coach friends only had it recently diagnosed because apparently girls are better at masking the symptoms of it. So is. Is there.

Is part of that in. In that number or do you know about that?

Kristina: 00:08:08

Yeah.

Dr. Theresa Lyons: 00:08:09

So the girls lost their diagnosis more than boys. And higher measured IQ was also another thing.

But other than that, there was no information except for what parents were doing as their children were getting better. They were actually scaling back on those behavioral approaches, which is counter to what mainstream media and what we're told, right?

We're told a child has to have 40 hours of ABA therapy.

So applied behavioral analysis, they have to be sitting at the desk One on one, they have to have repetition for them to show they know their letters. They have to point to a 10 times in a row and they have to get it nine times out of ten. Right. Otherwise they continue doing it over and over again.

And as a reward, you know, they can work towards like a cookie or an iPad or a break. Right. So the motivation is all extrinsic. So that is what parents scaled back on.

That was one of the most interesting things that that research showed that parents scaled back on what most people thought was actually would be the contributing factor to that change. And it's not. They didn't go into health, unfortunately. They didn't measure like vitamin D status.

Like I would love to know, right, what, what, what are they doing for health? Like basic health, just basic health. And then obviously then you could get more into root causes. So like gut infections, nutrition.

So what kind of nutrient deficiencies were there?

None of that were, was explored, which is, you know, the frustrating part, because that's the details, that's what matters, and that's also what varies child to child. So you can't just do the same thing for every child with autism because there's so much underlying biology that's different.

Herb: 00:10:07

So I hurt my head, did a lot of brain science and studying around my head, had my DNA pulled and I found out about the MTHFR gene and that expression and how not every person who has the MTHFR defect, as I think what they call it expression, has autism. But almost all the people with autism have some sort of a defect there. And that makes you susceptible to aluminum as well.

So is taking aluminum out of the diet. And then parents heard that they started doing chelation stuff and, and to try and remove heavy metals. Some of that helps.

Some of that chelation stuff is actually really hard on the kids too. So how did, how did parents doing this on their own affect the science going forward? Has that been studied more?

Dr. Theresa Lyons: 00:11:01

So there are studies showing different risk factors. There's not a study that shows one cause for all of autism. So that's what a lot of times parents are looking for.

People are looking for that one single thing that explains all of autism, but that's likely not ever going to be found because it's not just one thing. Autism isn't so simple like that.

So there are different studies about lead exposure and other heavy metals exposure, and there's a correlation between the amount of heavy metal exposure and the severity of autism. But again, not every child with autism has heavy metal exposure. So that's the important aspect. So chelation. Right. Very inappropriate if not needed.

Right. Especially if someone has difficulties being a picky eater.

You certainly don't want to do chelation that will withdraw minerals from what they've eaten. So. So there is seriousness to this, but there's also tests to do. Right.

So it's like, okay, just test to see if my child has high levels of heavy metals in it. Right. That's actually done typically in, well, baby visits. They typically do a blood test for lead.

The difference though is a blood test just shows like, recent exposure within the past, like three months. Ish. Right.

So if your child was exposed to it, maybe, you know, when they were six months and, and they're now getting tested at two years, you wouldn't expect, if they had that exposure, you wouldn't expect a blood test to come back positive. You would actually want to understand how the body stored that exposure. So what you usually do is a urine test.

That is what functional medicine doctors do when they're trying to understand heavy metal exposure in the past. So not necessarily that current, but these are all specifics, ins and outs, and only then does it make sense maybe, maybe to do chelation. Right.

The first step is really to make sure that the body is able to do that kind of detox. Right. So you do want your child to be eating right? Yes. And you do want them to be hydrated and you want them to be pooping well every day.

Because many kids with autism have digestive issues.

So you might actually have to address what's going on with digestion before you could even do some type of chelation or detoxing because the body wouldn't be prepared enough. So there's a lot of considerations for sure.

Kristina: 00:13:41

And, you know, everything we're talking about, you talk about with your doctor or your functional nutritionist, whoever you're working with. Right.

But at the same time, I want to really encourage parents to follow their gut instincts because sometimes it leads you to a space that you're practitioner hasn't thought about yet. So, you know, one example, a family that I've worked with, you know, there was accidentally mold toxicity that was incorporated as well.

So then when they correct that, they found that that was an issue for their child, you know, and that's why.

Dr. Theresa Lyons: 00:14:15

You want to do the testing.

Kristina: 00:14:16

Right.

Dr. Theresa Lyons: 00:14:17

So it's important to do the testing and have science guide you. So many times autism is when, when parents try to, to make an improvement in their child's health, they get criticized. Right.

Because it's, oh, well, you know, you're not really supposed to do anything about autism. That's just the way it is. And that's not true.

So there's definitely aspects of health that are impacted that prevent the child from doing what they want.

And that's really the important part, is to use the science to guide those decisions so you can kind of take away that feeling of, oh, am I doing the right thing? Am I not right? You have the intuition. Let's say mold. Okay, great. Go do a mold test. Comes back positive. Thank you. Intuition. Right.

Like, now I know what to focus on. And. And so that's how you have that ebb and flow between your intuition and science.

And that will give the parent more confidence that they're doing the right thing. And that's extremely hard because in autism, it just. There is no, like, 100% answer. This is what you should do.

So the more confidence a parent has that they're doing what their child needs, definitely the better.

Kristina: 00:15:34

Yeah. And that, you know, that's the hard part with it being a spectrum, or they used to always call it an ex. A spectrum. Right.

So whenever someone was diagnosed, he wasn't necessarily called autistic because he was on the high functioning, so he was Asperger's. And now they pretty much dropped that label kind of thing. But. Yeah.

Is that that variation throughout the different things, but the behavior modifications you were talking about? Oh, my golly. Just from an education standpoint, when a child doesn't feel supported or too much pressure or whatever, they kind of break down anyway.

And so then if you're having all those repetitive things that they already kind of knew how to do but couldn't necessarily voice or couldn't necessarily show, that's tough. And I'm so glad that some of these parents were, like, backing off on some of that stuff. Yeah.

Dr. Theresa Lyons: 00:16:23

And ABA has become controversial because many kids grew up with it 20 or 30 years ago, and now they're very vocal saying that that was very traumatic to have, you know, been asked repeatedly to do certain stuff. And sometimes they knew what to do, but their body just wasn't doing what they wanted. And then they would get nervous and anxious even more.

And so it's snowballing in the wrong direction.

And then from an educational standpoint, when you are teaching with extrinsic motivators, like a break or a cookie or, you know, iPad, something like that, that just really negates the love of learning.

Herb: 00:17:03

Right.

Dr. Theresa Lyons: 00:17:03

And it's like, okay, this is something I just have to do to get what I really Want. And. And it's not even necessarily something that benefits that child long term. Right.

Herb: 00:17:14

That's not even just with autism. They did the study of children who love to draw. And then they started.

Every time they gave, they drew, they gave them a star and told them how good they were doing. And then when they stopped giving them the star, the children stopped liking to draw because they stopped getting their reward. So.

Yeah, because it was. It became an intrinsic reward instead of them enjoying it because they enjoyed it.

Kristina: 00:17:37

Right.

Herb: 00:17:37

And behavior therapy wasn't trying to heal the child. It was trying to make them appear normal. It wasn't trying to. We're not fixing autism.

We're trying to make it so that people can't tell that you have it. And that's a completely different way of going about things. It's like, so you're healed if you fit into society and now appear normal. And that.

That's just not the way it works.

Kristina: 00:18:03

Yeah.

Dr. Theresa Lyons: 00:18:04

And that's definitely something that I'm not advocating for. Masking puts a tremendous amount of pressure on someone. And you are right in that women a lot.

The research shows that women do masking quite a bit as a way to really just fit in. But then a lot of times at home, that's when parents see completely different behaviors.

That's when someone just really lets things go and shows just how exhausted they are from the. From the day of having to do certain things just. Just to fit in. And. And that's. That's. That's really not the goal at all for any parent.

Herb: 00:18:48

So what is it the. What is the goal and what is it that you are teaching parents that. That helps them understand this and move through that.

Dr. Theresa Lyons: 00:18:57

So I teach parents the science. So first having the information about the 10% of optimal outcome, you know, over a decade ago, and then now the current information of 37%.

Parents need to know that so that they know. Okay. There is documented quality evidence showing that autism is not lifelong.

Herb: 00:19:18

The.

Dr. Theresa Lyons: 00:19:18

The most recent study was done in Boston Children's Hospital. So that is as pretty much mainstream medicine that you can get. So this is not questionable in the possibility.

But then it really becomes, how do I focus on what my child needs? And I always want parents to make sure that their child feels loved through this whole process. Right.

So it's not about saying, oh, there's something wrong with you. We need to fix this, and you need to be able to sit still, still. Right.

But it might be like, oh, wow, they have mold exposure, which is impacting their nervous system. So that's why they can't sit still or they have a gut infection. Right? And so that is what's causing some of these problems.

So that's why it's so important to, to take a look at your child and say, all right, what are those top three health issues that really impact their day? Maybe it's sleep, right? And then that's impacting the entire family. Right.

So it's important to get clear for the parents to, all right, these are the top three things that are really impacting the quality of life for our family. And then now how can we use science to resolve those? Something like sleep. The most basic step is understanding vitamin D status.

So many kids are deficient in vitamin D, and sometimes, not all the times, but sometimes the sleep problems, especially when kids can't fall. Fall asleep, it can be just deficiency in vitamin D. So simple.

And that can change so much now that it might not impact the actual autism diagnosis itself. But now the child is starting to sleep. All right, good. The parents are starting to sleep. Okay.

Now people can actually start thinking a little bit clearer. And then you can, you know, really focus on, okay, what is next? And again, use science. This is not about guessing. Or let me just try this.

Or I saw this work for someone in a Facebook group that I saw. And that that's not really how you want to go about this. You have to be very meticulous, you have to be organized and you have to be logical.

Herb: 00:21:30

So we're a little past this because, you know, our children, our child is in his 30s, but they started talking about Luca Varian, I think is the name of it. What do you do about parents who say, oh, I want this because it's going to cure my kid. How do you approach that?

Because I don't know the studies or the stats, but they're talking about how this really helps.

Dr. Theresa Lyons: 00:21:52

So this one is a controversial one. So. And let me unpack it because there's quite a bit of science in there. Right? So Leucovorin is prescription vitamin B9. Right.

So it's the downside of taking B9 is very small. Right? So that, that's one reason why parents are very excited about Leucavorin. Right? Because what's the downside? Too much vitamin B.

What does that mean? That means a child might get irritable, might have some difficulty sleeping. You stop it, those problems go away in a few days. Right.

Vitamin B is water soluble. It gets peed out, typically in the morning. So that's one of the reasons why there's interest in it. Other reasons are there's been no.

There was five clinical trials showing that kids who have autism and something called a folate antibody, when they were given leucovorin, they started speaking. One parent does not want that. Right. So there were five clinical studies.

Unfortunately, the largest one in January was retracted, which, you know, then. Oh, goodness, it's retracted. Right. What does that mean? The autism parents do not need retracted work because it just certainly complicates things.

It would be great if it was really trustworthy from the beginning.

And so there's still four clinical trials showing that leucovorin, when a child has a positive frat test test, really does make a difference with speech. And so that is why parents are very interested in it. If a parent wants to use leucovorin, I would highly recommend doing the frat test.

So you can do a blood test. It's called FRAT F R A T. It's a blood test and it will tell you if there are antibodies that impact folate getting into the brain.

So again, this is about focus, Right. So you can hear about it. Yes. And you hear kids have all this benefit. Okay. But you want to use science to make sure.

Kristina: 00:24:02

All right.

Dr. Theresa Lyons: 00:24:03

This is what is appropriate for my child. The science shows somewhere about 70% of kids with autism have this positive test. But again, the data is early, so we could say a decent number.

Right.

It would be wise for a parent, if they're interested, interested in, in understanding speech in their child to see if there is this frat test positive. And then if it is positive, then, you know, okay, this is something for us to focus on. So back to nutrition. Right.

So a lot of times kids who have these positive antibodies in their brain, they see a lot of benefit from going dairy free because dairy is triggering the immune system to be overactive. Right. So this is why it's not just about getting a script for Leucavorin, because there's so much that can go into it.

Now Leucavorin doesn't do anything to negate the antibodies. It doesn't do anything to turn off the immune system. Right. This, this particular B9 gets transported in the brain just slightly differently.

So that is how you're able to kind of go around and side door. And this problem that the antibody is blocking, so it's, it's nuanced. You don't start at the main dose, you start at a very small dose. Right.

Because you're impacting the brain. You just don't want to blast it with a lot of B9. So you have to be really, really mindful.

So there are some parents who hear about Leucovorin and they're like, all right, I'm going to try it. And the doctor maybe writes them a script and they just try it at a certain amount. And things go usually wrong. Right. Because you do.

You have to be meticulous. You have to understand the whole situation. And again, this might not be the place to start.

The question really is, why is my child's immune system so overactive? And so you want to have that whole picture.

Kristina: 00:26:04

It's one of those things that, you know, being a teacher in a classroom for so many years, I would have parents constantly say, oh, my. My child has to be hyperactive. They can't sit still. And you're even seeing they can't sit still. And, you know, would you recommend.

And of course, being a teacher, I could never say, yes, no, recommend. Not recommend. But just knowing me and my own personal self, I would always try to divert them first to, are they getting enough sleep?

Are they eating a healthy diet? Are they getting enough exercise? What else can you do? Have you had their eyes checked?

Because a lot of ADHD comes from the eyes because they can't focus quite right. So I would bring those things. And that's exactly what you're saying. Try those other kinds of things that might help impact before you go.

Maybe medication or something controversial. You know, that doesn't mean you don't do it, but what else can you do?

Dr. Theresa Lyons: 00:26:56

Yeah, yeah.

Herb: 00:26:56

You want to do the basics?

Kristina: 00:26:58

Yeah, yeah, I see.

Herb: 00:26:59

I'm in some coaching groups and, and we, we help each other with clients, and sometimes it's like they start describing the problems and all of the emotional and the work they're doing. And I like, what are they eating? Like, do they get sunshine? Are they going outside? Are they.

Kristina: 00:27:18

Yes.

Herb: 00:27:19

Human. Because some of those problems can actually be fixed by just turning back into a human being. And it's. It's not all of this other stuff. Let's.

Let's go back to this. This body and see if we can make the body comfortable. And once the body's comfortable, then the mind can relax.

Dr. Theresa Lyons: 00:27:37

Yeah, there's a lot to be said to that. The base sleep is. So there are two research studies on sleep and autism. I don't know why they had to do this, but they did.

And it shows that when a child with autism is not getting quality sleep, their autism symptoms increase. And so sleep is so vital for everything. So something like that is really the starting point.

And usually then parents lean in a bit more and they're like, okay, my child's sleeping. All right, things are starting to look better. And parents can see for themselves that autism doesn't necessarily have to be lifelong.

And they, they can imagine if that child just didn't get sleep for the rest of their life. Like, that's just rough, just disservice for, for that child and for those parents as well.

Kristina: 00:28:34

So let's give the parents a practical tip right now.

If you're telling them, you know, hey, we really need to get your child to sleep a little bit more, is there something that you maybe start the parents with, or is there something that they could look into to help their child sleep a little bit better?

Dr. Theresa Lyons: 00:28:48

Yeah, definitely. Vitamin D. Vitamin D, that's right.

Kristina: 00:28:51

You were just saying that.

Dr. Theresa Lyons: 00:28:52

Yeah, yeah. So for. So usually there's three problems with sleep in kids with autism. So one, they can't fall asleep.

So a lot of times parents give melatonin for that problem and it works very well. Right, because melatonin targets that I can't sleep vitamin D. It's always good to say, okay, what's the root cause?

You could use melatonin as a short term fix.

Kristina: 00:29:17

Right.

Dr. Theresa Lyons: 00:29:18

Okay, we'll just do that for a week or so and then let's get the blood test. Let's start looking at some gut infections.

Let's start really understanding that another sleep issue is their child might wake up but, like consistently. Oh, they're always up at like three or four. It's just constant. So a lot of times when parents see that it's a magnesium deficiency.

So again, pretty smart fix. You can also start to look at diet and see, okay, is my child getting really the proper nutrients that they need? Need.

So magnesium is really that, that supplement that targets.

Oh, they keep waking up at a particular time and then when they wake up at random times, many times it is from just muscle movements due to a lack of iron in their diet. So again, diet is so important.

So you could supplement or you could just, you know, start eating some beef liver, making sure there's, you know, more, more meat in the, the diet. So there's many different fixes for those health issues of not being able to sleep. So I definitely would start there.

And there's many different ways to quantify it so that you don't have to guess. And unfortunately, many kids can have more than one, so it might be hard to fall asleep and then they wake up.

And it's important to know why you're using Something so many times parents are. Are given melatonin to go to sleep, but they're also trying to give melatonin to have the child sleep through the night.

And that's not really the way melatonin works.

So this is why you really want to have a good strategy, have a good understanding, be able to have someone knowledgeable on your healthcare team, a doctor, so you can really talk things over.

Herb: 00:31:11

And there's two things that we haven't mentioned yet. Big, huge controversial ones in the diet, and that's sugar and caffeine. Okay. Oh, I'm. I mean, that. That might even.

Yeah, so I removed sugar from my diet and that calmed my brain down tremendously. And I stopped drinking caffeine years and years ago. And both of those have helped.

But again, super duper controversial, especially like, if your kids are going to school because there is so much sugar in the food and school.

So if, if you're worried about your diet, then the parents really should start preparing their kids, if they're preparing their kids food, if they go to school. But then it's like, okay, kids are kids. Here, you take this. Give me that. And then they. Yeah, all of the stuff anyway.

So, yeah, how do we help parents really grasp that? Because it's like, wow, diet's important, but it's also such a easy, quick and grab go. We don't think about food as a Western society.

Like, we don't sit down and eat. We grab and go fast food. How do we. How do we really impart the importance of this to parents in our current society?

Dr. Theresa Lyons: 00:32:34

Well, for kids with autism, there are some gut infections that make them even crave sugar more and more. So this is. Or different gut infections also that crave carbs.

So there are gut infections that can really drive the cravings and then shape what the child is eating.

So a child might only be eating, you know, pizza and macaroni and cheese or some kids, the parents try their best and, you know, cut out the cookies and the cake and stuff like that. But then they love peaches and mangoes and citrus fruit. Right.

So they're getting a lot of sugar, but it's from fruit, so it can be really deceptive that way. So it's, it's important for parents to, to understand how sugar is impacting them.

And if, if there is any intense craving, that should be a red flag as to, okay, there's. There's a health issue here.

And so really start to look at the gut and the gut infections, because you can go low sugar, but that's not necessarily going to really target the gut infection and remove the infection.

It will bring things down, obviously, but it's important if there's an infection, then to really focus on it and use the prescriptions that target that infection. So sugar is extremely important.

And there are some parents whose kids go to school and they end up just eating a bunch of junk food at school, even if they do send in food. Right. And so there, there are some parents who, who make a decision and say, you know what, for the next year or so, we're gonna homeschool.

And part of that reason is diet. So that's certainly something that's reasonable. If a parent is considering that it's it. Parents do do that.

Herb: 00:34:22

You said do do.

Kristina: 00:34:23

Sorry. That's one of the biggest, biggest things that when we help with health families.

I have one family that I work with and the mom just knew is like, you know, my child has this issue already. If I send them to the public school, then there's going to be extra anxiety because of too much noise.

There's going to be extra anxiety on the extra pressures of learning. There's going to be extra things that will possibly make my child even get worse instead of better.

So they just really looked at that as a holistic family value, as something that they wanted to do for their child, and they figured out how to do that. Homeschool again, across nutrition, you can do it across anxiety, you can do it across, you know, just learning differently. Right.

Herb: 00:35:11

But bullying in school, get them out.

Dr. Theresa Lyons: 00:35:13

Of school, and even sleep. So when sleep is difficult, a child might take longer to fall asleep at night.

And then if they have to wake up at six or seven o'clock in the morning, you know, they might not be getting the quality amount of sleep. So I certainly have seen parents who are, you know, say, we're going to homeschool. A lot of times it's when the child is young. So 4, 5, 6, 7. So.

Oh, and I said 6, 7. Now you do. And 6, 7.

Herb: 00:35:42

That doesn't mean anything to me.

Dr. Theresa Lyons: 00:35:48

But that's, that's a lot of times the, the window of age where parents say, all right, I'm gonna homeschool. And some then continue on for the rest of the years. And some say, right. When their child's like, hey, I wanna, I wanna go back to school.

Let me try, try it again. Right? So when you make that homeschool decision, it doesn't have to be forever.

Herb: 00:36:08

That's one of the things that we talk about. It's, it can. It can be for a goal. It can be for a period of time.

And if it doesn't work for you, at least you had that experience, and then maybe you can take that forward with you.

Dr. Theresa Lyons: 00:36:20

Yeah.

Herb: 00:36:21

All right, so here's a. Here's a honest, painful question.

Dr. Theresa Lyons: 00:36:25

Okay.

Herb: 00:36:25

When our son was diagnosed, there was a lot of shame and guilt and us trying to not look at it. Do you help parents look at that as well in themselves to. It's not their fault. It's. It's. We move through it because that.

That's a big part in why it was kind of difficult for us to reach out and to get help. Because of the shame in the way we were feeling. We felt because our child was different, and that was somehow our fault.

Dr. Theresa Lyons: 00:36:59

I think the shame piece is not there anymore. But I would say most parents, including myself, I went through that whole period of, okay, what did I do? And I was analyzing everything and. And did.

Did I somehow cause this? I think every parent goes through that. I just hope they don't stay there too long because it.

It's not a good space to be at when you have to negotiate all these things and figure out school and doctors and you. You want to have that emotion, and that shows a loving parent. Right. Like, oh, my goodness, what did I do? Right? You're.

You're saying that because you don't want to do it again. Right. And so. So sometimes it is something like mold. So parents start to pay attention to. To health very differently.

They start paying attention to diet very differently. So I think parents still have those emotions. I know I certainly did.

I just didn't stay stuck in them, which I think is important for parents so that they can find out what it is that their child needs.

Kristina: 00:38:09

I like looking at it as the cup half. Half full. Right. Instead of the cup half empty. Yes, there's something upsetting us. There's something wrong.

But what could we do if we do have that positive forward movement? And how can my child be impacted so much more positively if we keep moving?

Dr. Theresa Lyons: 00:38:29

Yeah. And that's. That's why autism, the.

The way I spell it, is a W, E, T, I, S M, because it is about having that love for your child and for holding on to the. The future of what it is that they want to do and helping them get there, there. So it's. It is really important to acknowledge the.

The difficulties and the challenges and then work together as a family, as a team, having good communication and to. To accomplish these different goals. That's why it's Important for parents to.

To really look at their family and say, okay, what are the top three things If. If we improved. Would improve quality of life? You know, maybe we'll start taking vacations. That.

And maybe that means, you know, one of the parents will. Will get a promotion. Right. Can work a bit more. Right. There's. There's so much that can be created, but you want to go at it as a team.

Kristina: 00:39:22

Yeah, exactly. Dr. Teresa, this has been amazing. Thank you so much for all the wisdom and all the insights and all those different things.

Would you please make sure you say out loud right now how families can get a hold of you if this has resonated with them and that they would love to have some. Some help from you.

Dr. Theresa Lyons: 00:39:39

Sure. So you can check out my website, navigating autism.com and again, autism is spelled A W E T I S M. And parents can also check me out on YouTube.

That's where I have over 10 years of science videos explaining different aspects of autism. So if any of the science I'm talking about is really resonating, you can hop on over to YouTube and check out more science there.

Kristina: 00:40:03

Beautiful. And of course, everything is down in the show notes as well.

So don't forget, all you have to do is go down below and hopefully just click, click, and it'll take you right there. But I always like to have it said out loud so those people, you know, kind of tunes into them. Thank you so much for being here today.

It has been an amazing journey, an amazing conversation. I. So thank you for all your help and wisdom.

Herb: 00:40:23

Yeah, thank you for being here.

Like when we went through it many years ago, we went through the shame and we kind of hit it, and you took it and you created a business and you are sharing it out to the world. So you took your problem, you fought your dragon, and you are bringing the information back to the world.

We kind of got a little late start, but we're helping that with that now. So you have been on a hero's journey. You fought your dragon, and you are bringing the information back to the village to share the wealth.

And that is the hero's journey. And so you are a hero for what you're doing. And so thank you for being on our podcast today.

Thank you for doing what you do, and thank you for actually making the world a better place through your actions.

Dr. Theresa Lyons: 00:41:06

Oh, thank you for the. Your kind words. I really appreciate them.

Kristina: 00:41:10

All right, audience, you know what time it is? It is time to, like, share and review. Make sure that this podcast and Dr. Lyons message is getting out to parents and families who need it. Right?

We all need a little support once in a while. It's nothing to be ashamed of. If we're helping each other, then our children can be raised in happy, healthy and successful ways. So until next time.

We will talk to you later.

Herb: 00:41:34

Bye for now.

Kristina: 00:41:34

Bye for now.